Is Normal Wear and Tear Covered Under Lifetime Cookware Guarantees?

[babywings76]

Have you all read yesterday's newswire? It talked about the Lifetime guarantee on cookware and how people have been getting replacements when they shouldn't have.

I guess the question I have is, what if after 10 years the non-stick finish starts flecking off or something. Could they say that is normal wear and tear? Or would that be considered a manufacturing defect? I wish they'd show a picture of "normal wear and tear".

 

[Lisa/ChefBear]

I was just going to try and send back a couple of my own pieces that have "hot spots" in them. No matter if I use on my stove or at shows, there's a couple of spots that stick and burn when using my 8 qt. stockpot and one of the fry pans. It's not "damaged" but there's something not right, wonder if that will be a problem. I couldn't believe some of those pics. WOW.

Lisa

 

[wadesgirl]

I usually don't get my newswire on time, can you post what they said in here?

 

[NooraK]

New Process in Place for Returned Cookware
Our Lifetime Guarantee on cookware is one way we exceed customers'' expectations. As you are aware from the Use and Care guidelines, our Lifetime Guarantee is for non-commercial use. The Guarantee excludes damage caused by abuse or misuse, such as improper cleaning, overheating, dishwasher cleaning (Professional and Executive cookware), use of caustic or other unapproved cleaners, ordinary wear and tear or an act of God.

Unfortunately, we''ve noticed an increasing number of returned cookware products that show clear signs of abuse or misuse, which are not covered under our Guarantee.

In order to maintain our cookware prices and Lifetime Guarantee, we will be inspecting all returned cookware for signs of the following:

Damage not covered under our Lifetime Guarantee. This includes ordinary wear and tear, use of metal or sharp-edged utensils on a non-stick surface, improper cleaning, use of machine dishwashing on non-stick cookware, along with use of non-stick sprays on Executive Cookware.

Damage covered by our Lifetime Guarantee, due to manufacturer''s or materials defects such as dents or scratches upon delivery, a broken handle or a silicone tear on the handle. In these instances, we''ll gladly replace the customer''s product or issue a refund.

If the damage is not covered under our Lifetime Guarantee, we''ll return the original product to the customer with a letter of explanation and a copy of our Use and Care guidelines.

Please note that this is not a change to our Lifetime Guarantee, but simply enforces what the Guarantee states.

Here are some examples of damaged cookware with issues not covered under our Lifetime Guarantee, and therefore not replaced nor a refund issued:


Improper cleaning

Use of metal or sharp-edged objects on non-stick cookware

Use of machine dishwashing on non-stick cookware

Abuse


We encourage you to familiarize yourself with the Certificate of Guarantee on the back of the Sales Receipt so you can accurately communicate the Lifetime Guarantee to your hosts and customers. Learn more about all of our product guarantees on the Online Training Center. Go to Consultant''s Corner > Consultant and Leadership Training > Online Training Center. Click on "Products" and scroll to the bottom of the page, where you''ll find a downloadable PDF.

You can also read the whole newswire and see the links here:

https://www.pamperedchef.com/repsonly/public_comm/weekly_bites/detail.jsp?id=455

 

[wadesgirl]

Makes sense, that's what it's always been about in the first place. I do agree that a lot of people are returning things for things that don't fall under the guarantee.

 

[babywings76]

Here's what it said:New Process in Place for Returned CookwareOur Lifetime Guarantee on cookware is one way we exceed customers' expectations. As you are aware from the Use and Care guidelines, our Lifetime Guarantee is for non-commercial use. The Guarantee excludes damage caused by abuse or misuse, such as improper cleaning, overheating, dishwasher cleaning (Professional and Executive cookware), use of caustic or other unapproved cleaners, ordinary wear and tear or an act of God. Unfortunately, we've noticed an increasing number of returned cookware products that show clear signs of abuse or misuse, which are not covered under our Guarantee.

In order to maintain our cookware prices and Lifetime Guarantee, we will be inspecting all returned cookware for signs of the following:
Damage not covered under our Lifetime Guarantee. This includes ordinary wear and tear, use of metal or sharp-edged utensils on a non-stick surface, improper cleaning, use of machine dishwashing on non-stick cookware, along with use of non-stick sprays on Executive Cookware.
Damage covered by our Lifetime Guarantee, due to manufacturer's or materials defects such as dents or scratches upon delivery, a broken handle or a silicone tear on the handle. In these instances, we'll gladly replace the customer's product or issue a refund.That's not very many instances. If that's all it covered, why would it be a Lifetime Guarantee? You discover scratches and dents within the first several months, I'd imagine.
If the damage is not covered under our Lifetime Guarantee, we'll return the original product to the customer with a letter of explanation and a copy of our Use and Care guidelines.
Please note that this is not a change to our Lifetime Guarantee, but simply enforces what the Guarantee states.Here are some examples of damaged cookware with issues not covered under our Lifetime Guarantee, and therefore not replaced nor a refund issued:

Improper cleaning
Use of metal or sharp-edged objects on non-stick cookware
Use of machine dishwashing on non-stick cookware
Abuse

We encourage you to familiarize yourself with the Certificate of Guarantee on the back of the Sales Receipt so you can accurately communicate the Lifetime Guarantee to your hosts and customers. Learn more about all of our product guarantees on the Online Training Center. Go to Consultant's Corner > Consultant and Leadership Training > Online Training Center. Click on "Products" and scroll to the bottom of the page, where you'll find a downloadable PDF.I think normal wear and tear should be covered. When we say something has a Lifetime Guarantee, we are saying that this will be the last set of cookware they will ever need to buy. That they can buy with confidence. But if after several years of taking good care of your cookware, following the U&C instructions, you have a problem with the non-stick coating, I would hope it could be replaced. And maybe it would be, but their focus on this is making me nervous that a lot of people's returns aren't going to end up being accepted.I know the phrase "normal wear and tear" is common w/ products in other companies that offer lifetime guarantee. It's just a little pet peeve of mine, I guess.

 

[babywings76]

Makes sense, that's what it's always been about in the first place. I do agree that a lot of people are returning things for things that don't fall under the guarantee.

I agree, there are probably lots of people abusing PC's generous replacement policy. They have every right to be stricter about things like this, because it's not fair to them to replace cookware where people have not followed the U&C instructions.

 

[nancycookspc]

Here's MY question regarding this-

I have all the cookware, have since it came out...been a consultant for 8 yrs I KNOW not to use anything that will scratch the pans, however- 2 of my fry pans are in need of replacement. There are scratches I think from food if that is possible. And my griddle is has not been non-stick for a LONG time. I just have been lazy to call.

SO How can that be If I follow the rules, no pam, no metal.

I hope they exchange it.

 

[elizabethfox]

It is pretty hard to determine who is voiding their warranty and who isn't, so I wonder how that is going to work out. I mean of course the pics they showed are all extreme examples of misuse or abuse of the product, but some instances aren't clear cut like that.

Lifetime means lifetime to me... Otherwise they should just have the cookware under limited warranty and list the instances in which it will or will not be replaced.

 

[Chefgirl2]

I have issues with this statement. First of all, when the Professional Cookware was introduced there was nothing in the use and care guide about putting the pans in the dishwasher voiding the warranty. It wasn't until a year or two later that was added. Secondly, it's only been recently that using non stick sprays would void the warranty.

Lastly, just send the grossly not washed stainless skillet back with a note telling them to buy bar keepers friend.

If we have a lifetime warranty on our non stick cookware that should include daily wear and tear...not abuse. I never use non stick sprays, put in the dishwasher or cook too high. If my cookware becomes sticky over the years then it must be a defect...or an outright lie saying that we have a lifetime non-stick coating.

Which is it? I'm picking up the phone to find out.

 

[chef131doreen]

I think it is going to be hard to explain to people that had there pans for 10-15 years and use them all the time they are going to get abused just by daily use and want to return them . I have my pans for 9 years and wash them by hand and fell I take care of them but they do have scraches on them ect I don't abuse them and they still could be changed ,
I think that now is when they are starting to return them cause they have had them awhile it does say life time and with the amount of cookware sales they should expect that to happen

 

[cookinforyou]

I was going to send some back too, I have a couple pieces I use daily. ( I have had it for 7 years) and the bottoms have barely any of the non stick left they look silver. I have not abused but do use!
Since I have become a rep I tell people they will never have to buy another set of cookware, I guess now I will add if you DO NOT USE IT!

 

[Chefgirl2]

According to Gina at HO 90% of the people don't follow the use and care directions once they get our products in their home.

Really? Are my customers the exception? Gina then said she didn't say 90%. She said most. What? It sounds like someone is making this up as she goes. I am fine with no metal, no abuse, no non stick sprays...I'm not fine with an evasive warranty that does not say if our coating is expected to last a lifetime with regular use. If not, this is not a Lifetime Warranty. Send me lables now to put in all of my catalogs that clearly state that our cookware has a Lifetime warranty.

I consider my customers pretty smart since they are investing in their kitchen when they buy our products. No one leaves a show without knowing exactly how to handle any non stick cookware and what will void our warranty.

This new policy reads like the only thing we cover (other damage in transaction) is the handles. According to "Gina" they will replace the item if company deems the cookware was properly used and the coating is defective. But, normal wear and tear would not be covered.

She could not tell me if the coating is expected to last a lifetime with normal use and care (AKA normal wear and tear).

Buy Our Cookware! We have a Lifetime Warranty on Our Cookware! {On the handles only...I'll quickly whisper under my breath}

This needs to be clarified if they want us to continue selling the Executive cookware.

I'm waiting for Gina's supervisor to call me back...:indif:

 

[chefjeanine]

Elaine,

I’m right there with you on this issue.

My stomach sunk when I read the email. Not guaranteed for normal use? In my vocabulary, that means it doesn’t have a lifetime guarantee.

I’ve been selling cookware for nearly 9 years. Don’t know what I’ll tell customers that are planning to buy now and SERIOUSLY don’t know what I’ll say to people who contact me regarding previous purchases. This seems like an attempt to avoid making good on a promise. I’m not pleased.

 

[ChefBeckyD]

Elaine,

I’m right there with you on this issue.

My stomach sunk when I read the email. Not guaranteed for normal use? In my vocabulary, that means it doesn’t have a lifetime guarantee.

I’ve been selling cookware for nearly 9 years. Don’t know what I’ll tell customers that are planning to buy now and SERIOUSLY don’t know what I’ll say to people who contact me regarding previous purchases. This seems like an attempt to avoid making good on a promise. I’m not pleased.

I'm there too. In fact, I'm thinking I may not even feature the cookware anymore. I HATE those prescription med commercials where the warnings and exceptions to the meds are longer than the commercial itself, and I would feel like I was doing the same thing to my customers if I even brought up the lifetime warranty. "It has a lifetime warranty, except if...............................................................................)" If there are more exceptions and exemptions then there is rule, then it's not really a lifetime warranty, and I feel like it's misleading advertising.

 

[babywings76]

I'm wondering if I should e-mail HO with my concerns. If enough of us e-mail, maybe they will revisit their wording and explain things better, and take off the "normal wear and tear" clause.

 

[ShelbyMichalek]

Consider the reason they don't cover "normal wear and tear".

You use your cookware for 10 years and it shows a little bit of use and wear. You return it, they replace it. 10 years later you do it again and they replace it. 10 years after that you return it, they replace it.

All because it had a little bit of "normal wear and tear" now you just got 3 sets of cookware for the price of one. That gets to be a hefty load from their pocket to replace USED cookware. That's 3 sets in 30 years.

I can just about gaurantee that my mother has had the same cookware she got when my parents got married 20 years ago. If she tried to have it replace NOT only would NONE of it be covered because it was a gift and wasn't purchased by a company as wonderful as ours, but there are minor signs of "normal wear and tear."

I honestly think that we have a GREAT policy on cookware in comparison to a frying pan or stock pot you go in to Wal-mart and purchase for $30 a piece.

Does that make sense?

 

[ChefBeckyD]

Consider the reason they don't cover "normal wear and tear".

You use your cookware for 10 years and it shows a little bit of use and wear. You return it, they replace it. 10 years later you do it again and they replace it. 10 years after that you return it, they replace it.

All because it had a little bit of "normal wear and tear" now you just got 3 sets of cookware for the price of one. That gets to be a hefty load from their pocket to replace USED cookware. That's 3 sets in 30 years.

I can just about gaurantee that my mother has had the same cookware she got when my parents got married 20 years ago. If she tried to have it replace NOT only would NONE of it be covered because it was a gift and wasn't purchased by a company as wonderful as ours, but there are minor signs of "normal wear and tear."

I honestly think that we have a GREAT policy on cookware in comparison to a frying pan or stock pot you go in to Wal-mart and purchase for $30 a piece.

Does that make sense?

Not when you've been telling people for the last 8 years that "this is the last cookware you'll ever have to buy". Where is the great policy? What else, besides "normal wear and tear" would be covered for a lifetime? Defects would be discovered well before a lifetime was up. As Elaine said - no one has given any info regarding if the Autograph coating was supposed to stand up to normal wear and tear for a lifetime. If it won't - then there should be no lifetime warranty. But that puts those of us who have been selling it with a lifetime warranty in a very sticky situation, because WE are The Pampered Chef to our customers, and we are the ones who will look bad to them, when their cookware, which they thought was covered, isn't really.

Oh - the language - "this is the last cookware you'll ever have to buy" is verbiage I've used for years - and straight from training tapes from PC.

 

[pattikake]

I always tell my guests that our cookware is just like L.L. Bean slippers! This is the last cookware and/or last pair of slippers you'll ever have to buy. People are interested in the lifetime warranty and I know that a lot of my customers have purchased them based on the warranty alone.

 

[Becca_in_MD]

I was thinking about the LL Bean slippers, too.

 

[chefjeanine]

Not when you've been telling people for the last 8 years that "this is the last cookware you'll ever have to buy". Where is the great policy? What else, besides "normal wear and tear" would be covered for a lifetime? Defects would be discovered well before a lifetime was up. As Elaine said - no one has given any info regarding if the Autograph coating was supposed to stand up to normal wear and tear for a lifetime. If it won't - then there should be no lifetime warranty. But that puts those of us who have been selling it with a lifetime warranty in a very sticky situation, because WE are The Pampered Chef to our customers, and we are the ones who will look bad to them, when their cookware, which they thought was covered, isn't really.

Oh - the language - "this is the last cookware you'll ever have to buy" is verbiage I've used for years - and straight from training tapes from PC.

Exactly! I think that's why this is making me feel so horrible.

There's been a change in quality over the past few years and customers are noticing (believe me, it’s not something I go around discussing). I have had one Host (who was a huge fan) stop buying. This issue with cookware just adds more fuel to that fire.

 

[ShelbyMichalek]

Right, but think about it more. Just because it shows signs of use doesn't mean it's useless! It still works just as good as the day you bought it!!

Now I'll be the first to admit that sometimes a customer has an issue that is most likely an error in the product and that our company has had some quality issues recently, but just because the color has grayed a little or you get a bit of a scratch here and there, doesn't mean you can't still use it!

This is just my opinion. I was raised to believe that until something is destroyed, it's good enough to be used. If you're not willing to use something because you're angry you spent $80 on it and it has a slight scratch on the bottom of it, then that's YOUR waste of that $80 and YOUR choice to discontinue using it.

 

[elizabethfox]

If I pay $148 for a 12" skillet that is non-stick and has a lifetime warranty I expect that to be upheld.

PC is the one who decided to put a LIFETIME warranty on the cookware. LIFETIME means LIFETIME. We have been selling it as the last cookware you will ever need to buy like Becky said and if one of my customers sends back a 12" skillet and pays at least $20 or more to ship it only to receive the same skillet back with a note saying.. sorry charlie.. we aren't replacing it because it has been misused and abused I will be the one getting the brunt of the customers wrath for supposedly selling them a lifetime product who's warranty is not being upheld. Especially if they were following the use and care. PC also will be losing good customers!

In fact this notice couldn't have come at a worse time. I just had a host bring out her stir fry skillet and 12" skillet and show me that the whole bottom of the pan(s) are discolored and looks like the non stick coating has just been eaten away. She doesn't own a dishwasher so she has always washed by hand.. all her utensils are from PC.. either executive tools or silicone spatulas.. never used metal utensils on it.. yet the inside of the pans look like they have been through a war zone! I would hate to have her pay to ship both of those heavy pans back only to have them sent right back to her and have her told it wasn't replaced because she didn't take care of them properly.

Right, but think about it more. Just because it shows signs of use doesn't mean it's useless! It still works just as good as the day you bought it!!

Now I'll be the first to admit that sometimes a customer has an issue that is most likely an error in the product and that our company has had some quality issues recently, but just because the color has grayed a little or you get a bit of a scratch here and there, doesn't mean you can't still use it!

This is just my opinion. I was raised to believe that until something is destroyed, it's good enough to be used. If you're not willing to use something because you're angry you spent $80 on it and it has a slight scratch on the bottom of it, then that's YOUR waste of that $80 and YOUR choice to discontinue using it.

 

[ShelbyMichalek]

....
In fact this notice couldn't have come at a worse time. I just had a host bring out her stir fry skillet and 12" skillet and show me that the whole bottom of the pan(s) are discolored and looks like the non stick coating has just been eaten away. She doesn't own a dishwasher so she has always washed by hand.. all her utensils are from PC.. either executive tools or silicone spatulas.. never used metal utensils on it.. yet the inside of the pans look like they have been through a war zone! I would hate to have her pay to ship both of those heavy pans back only to have them sent right back to her and have her told it wasn't replaced because she didn't take care of them properly.

In that instance she needs to call HO and tell them about her issue. Like I said, yes, there are sometimes defects and I'll be the first to admit the company is having some quality issue.

 

[ChefBeckyD]

Like I said, if you'd been selling LIFETIME WARRANTIED cookware for 8 years, and had 8 years of hosts and customers who think they've invested(another word we've been taught to use to explain the cost) in the last cookware they'll ever have to buy, only to find out it may or may not be true, you might have a different perspective on this. PC has changed the rules midstream - and that's not right.

 

[AmyDare]

Consider the reason they don't cover "normal wear and tear".

I can just about gaurantee that my mother has had the same cookware she got when my parents got married 20 years ago. If she tried to have it replace NOT only would NONE of it be covered because it was a gift and wasn't purchased by a company as wonderful as ours, but there are minor signs of "normal wear and tear."

I was given RevereWare cookware when I got married in 1988. The handle fell off my stockpot a couple of years ago, and I sent the RevereWare people an email, because it's supposed to be lifetime guarantee.
They emailed me back and asked what size pot I would like. I didn't even have to mail them the original pot. SO...a lifetime warranty should be a lifetime warranty.

 

[chefsteph07]

Shelby, I think you are missing the point/big picture. Those of us who have been selling for years have been telling our customers "this is the last cookware piece, set, etc you will ever have to buy"...that is hardly the same as saying that it is as good as the day you bought it if it does stick due to normal use. My 8" saute pan that I earned from the panorama when these first came out is peeling the nonstick on the inside where the lip is, but it's all around. Guess what, I have only used this pan to make eggs and grilled cheese. I have NOT called to get a replacement but I do show this pan at my demos. In the back of my mind I have been thinking of getting a replacement, but what would they say now?

My stomach sank as well when I read that email and I am glad this thread was started. I think they are renegging on their commitment to offer a "lifetime" guarantee. And, if you buy this cookware and it lasts for 10 yrs but the nonstick coating starts to wear off, I would think I was certainly entitled to get a new one, and 10 yrs after that, and so on! Why is that wrong when I was "told" that I could in the first place?

I am no longer going to show or talk about cookware because I don't want to deal with the headaches of having to explain the warranty or think that I as a consultant was misleading or give PC a bad name for selling something that said "lifetime" but it's on the handles. Give me a break.

 

[cookinforyou]

If I pay $148 for a 12" skillet that is non-stick and has a lifetime warranty I expect that to be upheld.

In fact this notice couldn't have come at a worse time. I just had a host bring out her stir fry skillet and 12" skillet and show me that the whole bottom of the pan(s) are discolored and looks like the non stick coating has properly.

this is how my set is especially my two most used pieces. it looks like someone took the black paint off of them.

 

[babywings76]

Right, but think about it more. Just because it shows signs of use doesn't mean it's useless! It still works just as good as the day you bought it!!

Now I'll be the first to admit that sometimes a customer has an issue that is most likely an error in the product and that our company has had some quality issues recently, but just because the color has grayed a little or you get a bit of a scratch here and there, doesn't mean you can't still use it!

This is just my opinion. I was raised to believe that until something is destroyed, it's good enough to be used. If you're not willing to use something because you're angry you spent $80 on it and it has a slight scratch on the bottom of it, then that's YOUR waste of that $80 and YOUR choice to discontinue using it.

I think I know what you mean, that some people are expecting it to be "perfect" forever. Yes, just a little scratch or slight discoloration might seem trivial. But...most people get nervous to use a pan when the coating is coming off. No one feels good about the thought of ingesting that. Some people have had things show signs of use, but their main issue is when it's no longer acting non-stick or it's peeling or something. Then when HO see's it and they say "oh, that's just everyday wear and tear," that's when I'd be ticked that I paid a lot of money for something, plus paid to ship that back.

 

[elizabethfox]

PC has changed the rules midstream - and that's not right.

Exactly :thumbdown:

 

[chef131doreen]

So I just listened to Lisa Amblo again the Queen of selling Cookware , Now we have been trained by her and she says LIFETIME all the time , If you scrach it you will get another one and on and on , This is why people buy our cookware because of the LIFETIME replacment
Maybe HO should listen to the training they tell us to listen too

Player

 

[heat123]

I was Suprised and disapointed with this newswire. If they are no longer going to Honor the Lifetime warrenty (especially on every day wear and tear) then I agree, they need to relable it limited lifteime warrenty! I totally get the misuse or abuse but come on.... Rididculous!

 

[nikked]

ditto to the why have we been selling it as "lifetime" if it's not really lifetime crowd!

 

[RMDave]

I guess the term "lifetime" has different meanings to different people. I mean, a "lifetime warranty" does mean something different to an 85 year old grandmother than to her 25 year old grandchild.

 

[nikked]

Hubby just brought up that folks that purchased under the "lifetime warranty" banner may begin suing...I know I probably would if something like this happened...false advertising and all that jazz...big can o worms for TPC.

 

[RMDave]

Well if there is a Class Action lawsuit against TPC, my guess is that Consultants won't be dragged into it ... TPC has the cash, we have none .. our biggest mistake was drinking the KoolAid that HO happily provided.

 

[Chefgirl2]

Read carefully and make your own decisions.

This policy change is a work in progress. According to HO they have replaced so many products that should never have been returned due to OBVIOUS misuse. If guests are using the products according to "use and care" and if it comes to needing to be replaced then on inspection it will be obvious to the home office on how it was treated.

They are taking each return case by case.

I thought of the L.L.Bean reference made earlier. I love L.L. Bean! My daughter got a backpack with wheels when she started 1st grade. In 3rd grade I noticed her initials had unravelled and the bottom of the bag was beginning to look worn out. I had it replaced. Toward the end of 5th grade the bottom started to look worn again. I didn't replace it because I felt like we didn't deserve to get a brand new bag. For two years she drug that bag through mudpuddles and gravel daily. Yes, I paid over $70, but turning it in for a replacement didn't seem quite right since it still worked. We eventually retired that bag in 7th grade when using a backpack on wheels wasn't the "cool" thing to do anymore. I feel like I got my money's worth with that bag.

I know many people would argue that the company wants them to send it back in for a new one. I think the company knows that most people feel like they got years of value out of their products. It might not look the grandest, but it still does the job. Pampered Chef cannot afford to replace items that have been abused by ignorance or on purpose knowing "it" can be replaced.

I'm going to educate my guests and past customers on why we have such a great policy and affordable prices. By treating their products normally they will have a lifetime of great cooking. If by some chance there is peeling then the company will easily be able to see a true defect if one should occur. When they ask me for help I'll give them the 1888-our-chef number at let them know that when they call they will be asked these questions:

1. Which piece of cookware?
2. How have you been using it? (Stovetop, oven...campfire?)
3. When did you first notice the problem? (5 years or just the other day)
4. Tell me a bit about how you use it? How you store it? (stacking cookware without protectors or cloths can cause scratching which can lead to peeling)
5. What type of utensils do you use?
6. How do you clean it?

If there is no obvious misuse then they will be asked to mail in the cookware for inspection. The company will easily be able to identify misuse from defect and if they aren't doing anything to cause damage then it must be a manufacturer's defect with the coating.

I am going to save these questions on my desktop so I can see if it is worth my customer's time to even call, and to make sure they aren't mislead.

During my 4 calls that I made to HO about this I encountered 2 argumentative and sarcastic reps. I am in the habit of jotting down names before I speak "Hi Jill (and Gina), this is Elaine(writing down her name as I talk) I could not believe the attitude that Jill slung at me! And, it wasn't even about my question, but about another change that I hadn't even thought about. Both reps were condescending and got louder when I questioned them on the warranties that I knew had changed after the products were on the market. When their supervisor called me back I let her know that my upline director, Beth Jacob, was addament that I let HO know about both girls being rude. Funny, when I asked Jill to stop yelling she dramatically whispered that I should call my upline director. I told her I didn't appreciate her being a smart***.

This is my reputation on the line. Goodbye. I picked up the phone and called Beth who made me see the how and why's of the change and have faith that it is going to be okay. A few minutes later HO called, I was given the above info and hopefully, Jill and Gina are both being repremanded so they won't tick off consultants or our customers. I also sang the praises of rep Debi who should really get a raise for her patience in dealing with these calls all day.

Then I asked about the lid for the DCB and how I need it to be a replacement part...which is another thread that I am too tired to start right now.

 

[Dina Atnip]

I emailed HO about my concerns I totally disagree with this. Unless they could tell if a very sharp object was used to damage the cookware. Normal use should show a difference and since it is lifetime then lifetime it should be.

 

[chefsteph07]

I guess the term "lifetime" has different meanings to different people. I mean, a "lifetime warranty" does mean something different to an 85 year old grandmother than to her 25 year old grandchild.

Why should it matter if I sell a piece to an 85 yr old or a 25 yr old? Does that mean that 2 sets of rules apply to each? Lifetime should mean lifetime, whatever age you are.

 

[chefsteph07]

Read carefully and make your own decisions.

This policy change is a work in progress. According to HO they have replaced so many products that should never have been returned due to OBVIOUS misuse. If guests are using the products according to "use and care" and if it comes to needing to be replaced then on inspection it will be obvious to the home office on how it was treated.

They are taking each return case by case.

I thought of the L.L.Bean reference made earlier. I love L.L. Bean! My daughter got a backpack with wheels when she started 1st grade. In 3rd grade I noticed her initials had unravelled and the bottom of the bag was beginning to look worn out. I had it replaced. Toward the end of 5th grade the bottom started to look worn again. I didn't replace it because I felt like we didn't deserve to get a brand new bag. For two years she drug that bag through mudpuddles and gravel daily. Yes, I paid over $70, but turning it in for a replacement didn't seem quite right since it still worked. We eventually retired that bag in 7th grade when using a backpack on wheels wasn't the "cool" thing to do anymore. I feel like I got my money's worth with that bag.

I know many people would argue that the company wants them to send it back in for a new one. I think the company knows that most people feel like they got years of value out of their products. It might not look the grandest, but it still does the job. Pampered Chef cannot afford to replace items that have been abused by ignorance or on purpose knowing "it" can be replaced.

I'm going to educate my guests and past customers on why we have such a great policy and affordable prices. By treating their products normally they will have a lifetime of great cooking. If by some chance there is peeling then the company will easily be able to see a true defect if one should occur. When they ask me for help I'll give them the 1888-our-chef number at let them know that when they call they will be asked these questions:

1. Which piece of cookware?
2. How have you been using it? (Stovetop, oven...campfire?)
3. When did you first notice the problem? (5 years or just the other day)
4. Tell me a bit about how you use it? How you store it? (stacking cookware without protectors or cloths can cause scratching which can lead to peeling)
5. What type of utensils do you use?
6. How do you clean it?

If there is no obvious misuse then they will be asked to mail in the cookware for inspection. The company will easily be able to identify misuse from defect and if they aren't doing anything to cause damage then it must be a manufacturer's defect with the coating.

I am going to save these questions on my desktop so I can see if it is worth my customer's time to even call, and to make sure they aren't mislead.

During my 4 calls that I made to HO about this I encountered 2 argumentative and sarcastic reps. I am in the habit of jotting down names before I speak "Hi Jill (and Gina), this is Elaine(writing down her name as I talk) I could not believe the attitude that Jill slung at me! And, it wasn't even about my question, but about another change that I hadn't even thought about. Both reps were condescending and got louder when I questioned them on the warranties that I knew had changed after the products were on the market. When their supervisor called me back I let her know that my upline director, Beth Jacob, was addament that I let HO know about both girls being rude. Funny, when I asked Jill to stop yelling she dramatically whispered that I should call my upline director. I told her I didn't appreciate her being a smart***.

This is my reputation on the line. Goodbye. I picked up the phone and called Beth who made me see the how and why's of the change and have faith that it is going to be okay. A few minutes later HO called, I was given the above info and hopefully, Jill and Gina are both being repremanded so they won't tick off consultants or our customers. I also sang the praises of rep Debi who should really get a raise for her patience in dealing with these calls all day.

Then I asked about the lid for the DCB and how I need it to be a replacement part...which is another thread that I am too tired to start right now.

Elaine, thanks for this info...so did they admit that these changes were "new" for the lifetime warranty, or are they saying that all these rules have already been in place since day one and they are just NOW enforcing them like this?

Oh, and about the replacement DCB lid, I hear ya. I have TWO bakers with bottoms and no tops. One of them a customer dropped at her show 2 yrs ago, I called HO and explained what happened and got no problems with a replacement (in fact, the CS girl even overnight me a new baker bc I told her I needed it for a show), then a month ago, my lid slid off my counter after I washed it and it shattered. This time however, the girl was no so understanding. She informed me that how it broke did not fall under the warranty and I had to buy a whole new baker!

So, I did..(and ONLY used the lid for it) bc I use it at EVERY show and at least 3x a week at home but I was shocked and upset! I said I couldn't believe I couldn't just order a new lid and she basically said that's the way it goes...no sympathy, nothing...

 

[RMDave]

Why should it matter if I sell a piece to an 85 yr old or a 25 yr old? Does that mean that 2 sets of rules apply to each? Lifetime should mean lifetime, whatever age you are.

Yes but "lifetime" does in fact mean different things to different people.

If you were a plumber who installed an all "Copper" sprinkler system for your client on the basis of it lasting a long time, and the client who "bought into it" was 85 years old, in many courts, the plumber would be considered taking advantage of an elderly client.

 

[nancycookspc]

HMMMM- I wonder what the TEST kitchens pots look like???

 

[chefjeanine]

Here’s what I think needs to happen now. Pampered Chef eliminates the “lifetime guarantee” label for anything purchased after 03-31-2010. Anything purchased prior will be treated the way many of us view “lifetime”.

I don’t know what they can or would call the new guarantee but I truly think this policy needs to be changed. . . NOW!

 

[RMDave]

Well its going to take a while for HO do do anything. First it has to be run by their "Legal" department and then they need the new policy signed off at every step of the process. Just be careful what you say about the pots and pans.

 

[chefjeanine]

Well its going to take a while for HO do do anything. First it has to be run by their "Legal" department and then they need the new policy signed off at every step of the process. Just be careful what you say about the pots and pans.

Hey, if they were not yet ready to take action, they should not have started talking out loud. A lot can be accomplished in a very short amount of time when it needs to happen.

 

[chefsteph07]

Yes but "lifetime" does in fact mean different things to different people.

If you were a plumber who installed an all "Copper" sprinkler system for your client on the basis of it lasting a long time, and the client who "bought into it" was 85 years old, in many courts, the plumber would be considered taking advantage of an elderly client.

I have no idea what that even has to do w/ anything.
Are you saying that we all "bought into" the fact that we have been trained for years to belive one thing when in fact it really was different all along just to sell cookware and now they are tired of replacing all these pieces so NOW they are implementing their "real" warranty? So, are we all being taken advantage of?

We have all be TRAINED to tell our customers "this is the last set of cookware you will EVER buy"...whether I sell to a 19 yr old college student or an 85 yr old woman who tires of buying a $20 pan every 6 mo.

I don't believe that ANY of us has interpreted "lifetime guarantee" any other way than what we have been trained on from National Conferences to tapes, to training meetings, etc. Obviously, or else all of us would not be questioning this "new" policy.

 

[littlemaisyPC]

To me lifetime means an investment. The product should last a lifetime not your lifetime, so you should be able to pass it on to your children and they can continue to enjoy the lifetime gurantee as well. I also say "this will be the last cookware you'll ever have to buy". Sad that this will have to change.

 

[ShelbyMichalek]

I have no idea what that even has to do w/ anything.
Are you saying that we all "bought into" the fact that we have been trained for years to belive one thing when in fact it really was different all along just to sell cookware and now they are tired of replacing all these pieces so NOW they are implementing their "real" warranty? So, are we all being taken advantage of?

We have all be TRAINED to tell our customers "this is the last set of cookware you will EVER buy"...whether I sell to a 19 yr old college student or an 85 yr old woman who tires of buying a $20 pan every 6 mo.

I don't believe that ANY of us has interpreted "lifetime guarantee" any other way than what we have been trained on from National Conferences to tapes, to training meetings, etc. Obviously, or else all of us would not be questioning this "new" policy.

For one, why is an 85 year old woman buying a pan every 6 months? That's not normal. My 89 year old Grandmother has had 3 sets of cookware her entire life and I don't think she ever went out every 6 months to buy another $20 pan.

Second. Not "all of us" are questioning this "new" policy. Not only is it not NEW it is simply being ENFORCED. But I'm not questioning it at all.

Let me ask this. If you were someone up there in charge with HO wouldn't you be really pissed off if someone sent in a pan completely and rudely expecting a replacement when it was obvious they ran it over 40 times? That may seem exaggerated but that is simply the point they are trying to make! They don't want you abusing your products and expecting something in return! They WILL admit when they have a defective product! Since when haven't they? But this is them taking a stand for all the money they've wasted on some careless customers!

Don't blame the Home Office. Blame the people abusing the system.

 

[chefsteph07]

For one, why is an 85 year old woman buying a pan every 6 months? That's not normal. My 89 year old Grandmother has had 3 sets of cookware her entire life and I don't think she ever went out every 6 months to buy another $20 pan.

Second. Not "all of us" are questioning this "new" policy. Not only is it not NEW it is simply being ENFORCED. But I'm not questioning it at all.

Let me ask this. If you were someone up there in charge with HO wouldn't you be really pissed off if someone sent in a pan completely and rudely expecting a replacement when it was obvious they ran it over 40 times? That may seem exaggerated but that is simply the point they are trying to make! They don't want you abusing your products and expecting something in return! They WILL admit when they have a defective product! Since when haven't they? But this is them taking a stand for all the money they've wasted on some careless customers!

Don't blame the Home Office. Blame the people abusing the system.

Ok, so maybe it's not "normal" for an 85 yr old woman to buy a pan every sisx mo, that was a slight exaggeration, but I WILL say that "I" used to buy cookware ONCE A YEAR before PC. And, I didn't run it over 40 times! (and, that cookware was a bit more than $20 per pan)

And I would say that the majority of consultants WILL be questioning this version of the warranty. If you have been around PC any length of time, you will know how we have been told BY HO to present the cookware to our customers.

 

[babywings76]

For one, why is an 85 year old woman buying a pan every 6 months? That's not normal. My 89 year old Grandmother has had 3 sets of cookware her entire life and I don't think she ever went out every 6 months to buy another $20 pan.

Second. Not "all of us" are questioning this "new" policy. Not only is it not NEW it is simply being ENFORCED. But I'm not questioning it at all.

Let me ask this. If you were someone up there in charge with HO wouldn't you be really pissed off if someone sent in a pan completely and rudely expecting a replacement when it was obvious they ran it over 40 times? That may seem exaggerated but that is simply the point they are trying to make! They don't want you abusing your products and expecting something in return! They WILL admit when they have a defective product! Since when haven't they? But this is them taking a stand for all the money they've wasted on some careless customers!

Don't blame the Home Office. Blame the people abusing the system.

I totally agree that they need to be enforcing their policy. I agree that people abusing the system makes it a big expense and HO needs to put an end to people getting away with it. The main issue I have is that of the expression of normal wear and tear. It's the fact that the latest non-stick coating hasn't been around a lifetime. They don't know how it's going to wear many years down the road. If I take care of my cookware properly, and over time it loses it's non-stick properties or it develops bad scratches even with using the proper tools, or it starts coming off, I'm going to want a replacement. My question is will that be covered or will they say it's normal wear and tear? They gave pictures of all the other categories, but not of what they feel is something that is normal wear and tear that they wouldn't accept. This is where the clarification needs to come in.

 

[chefsteph07]

Amanda, where were the pics? I must have missed that.

 

[Curlyone]

This has really gotten me upset too. I sent back my skillet from my kit (less than a year old) and they replaced it and the peeling spatula. I have been using the skillet for only eggs that I cook, no one else in my family even touches my pans, the new pan (it is about 9 months old now) is in just as bad a shape as the first one that I returned.

I can see why with using the photos they provided, they would not replace the products, but come on now, if I can get my pans to peel and I am the consultant, what am I supposed to tell my customers? Lifetime means lifetime period! That is what they teach us and that is what I tell my customers. These pans come out of China, could it be possible that the quality assurance / inspectors are not catching a problem? Maybe PC needs to see it from the manufacturing site as a possible issue, not from the customer side as their misuse or abuse.

And ditto on the DCB lid. I don't even use the large oven mits when handling that cover. I make sure that I use one that has a grip on it. Mine has a hairline crack in it, but I won't be sending it back! They really need to make it a replacement part.